Are you better than my doctor? - Elbow (Ulnar Nerve) Injury for 7 months

[TheQuest]

Hey there,

Ive been having elbow problems since late January 2014.

The trigger of my problem was probably(!) a combination of those two exercises:

-Swedish Bars Front Support ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvuWwMcwRXM )

-Swedish Bars Back Support ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDCr_lXDd64&list=UUPCiBMarvDiTx-lknzt934g )

I combined them into following interval sequence:

D1. Swedish Bars Front Support 10-30 sec

D2. Swedish Bars Back Support 10-30 sec

-Repeat D1, D2 for a total of 5 sets, resting 45-90 sec between exercises

*I found this whole sequence on Ido Portal's blog and youtube account. However, i had basically no experience before in straight arm strength or support exercises ( maybe done L-sits some times before, however nothing structured). Means, my elbows weren't prepared at all for this stress, and of course, it resulted in injury. Around the same time, i messed around with tucked front lever and back lever tucks,-probably progressed too quick here too- that may have contributed to the paint injury symptoms I've been having since then. However, i did a heck lot of unstructured strength training, skill work , played more tennis than usual at that time, so it could also be some "collective injury/pain trigger". Basically: I was totally retarded.
​When Im looking back, Im thinking like " wtf did you do to your body?- injury out of what you did was a certainty".
This was in late January 2014.
​So , please don't tell me this was dumb.
Much rather, Id appreciate any input what you would do in my situation.

What I did so far:

Since then, Ive been to 2 doctors, and 3 physios.- Yet, nothing great has changed. 1 doctor and 1 physio was shit, ( diagnosis of them: tendonitis or bursitis, advice: rest and it will go away. also: never extend your elbows fully!! - "yes for sure, i thought",- and went.

The other sports orthopedist and physio ( and osteopath ) both diagnosed me ( independently of each other) with some kind of ulnar irritation.- this made perfect sense, as my pain was in that funny bone- area, and when i accidentally would bump my elbow against something- it would hurt as well. So: DIAGNOSIS: Some kind of Ulnar Nerve Irritation. However, its very local and ISN’T radiating down the arm, and also ISN’T initiating some tingling sensations in my pinky.

The sports orthopedist also found out ( via x-ray and visual inspection) that my elbows are having some slight valgus deformity- means their angles isn't around 180 degrees, but more about 168 degrees. Hence- he said- i ve been predisposed to those problems,and this external stress triggered my injury. He prescribed me physiotherapy for strengthening and stabilizing the elbow joint as well as ultrasonic therapy and cryotherapy. Im doing ultrasonic 2 x a week, each arm 10 min. , right after it cryotherapy 1 min. i think, also both elbows.

Then, last week, my phyio added a new thing to this Diagnosis: He said he thinks my ulnar nerve isn’t really lying inside the cubital tunnel properly, it is more like slid up ( the medial epycondile i guess). Hence, increased friction ( because of that improper alignment) to my ulnar nerve could be the reason why my elbow still is doing trouble to me. ( Considering i stopped doing all sports since i found out this could be something severe ( around the beginning of March 2014, maybe even earlier).

Supplements: Im also taking the following supplements (as advised my 2 good(!) physios:)

• Vitamin B complex
• Vitamin D
• liquid fish oil, 2 teaspoons a day

Exercises:

Those exercises have been prescribed to me recently:

• side-lying external rotation with 1kg dumbbell ( 3 x ~20, daily)

• Sitting/Standing External Rotation with 2 kg in each hand (3x ~20, daily). ( heres a photo of this so we both talk about the same: http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/cms/articleimages/884/External-Rotation-Standing2.jpg

So im doing those exercises daily, and also go to the physio about 2 times a week, where he does some manual manipulation. He said my ulnar nerve isn’t really in its "cubital tunnel" and IF its in,it always tends to hop out again , so he tries to bring it back in its groove permanently via some nerve mobility manipulation. The given exercises should reinforce so much stability to it, so it will hold the nerve stable. Also he tries to get some tension out of the adjacent muscles, also out of the neck, the lats and the upper arm. ( Since the nerve is going all the way down from the neck to the pinky). Thats about what was told to me.


So this is about my treatment plan, but im not very sure if it will really give me the kind of relief i was hoping for. Until now, it didn't.

If you'd had any input, Id be very glad.

Thank you!

[Jonas Hohmann]

Anybody? Why is this having 0 views, also? 

[Mikkel Ravn]

I feel for you, but I'm not qualified to add anything. Perhaps try pm'ing Mark Collins, MT Nordic, or one of the other professionals who are on the forum?

[Cole Dano]

Try the exercises in this post 

 

https://www.gymnasticbodies.com/forum/topic/5284-elbowwrist-prehab-routine/

 

both the first one and the ulnar nerve tensioner

 

this vid has a glide variation of the same 

 

 

Those stall bar supports are really a bad idea to being challenging beginners to try, sadly this is the result.

[Aaro Helander]

I'm also not qualified to add anything, except that the very same Ido Portal progressions have destroyed mine and my friend's forearms a couple of years back. Just did wrist and bandwork and as of 2014 my arms and wrists feel pretty indestructible.

[ASForum]

I'm also not qualified to add anything, except that the very same Ido Portal progressions have destroyed mine and my friend's forearms a couple of years back. Just did wrist and bandwork and as of 2014 my arms and wrists feel pretty indestructible.

Could you point to what/ which ones did you practice? The ones linked above? 

[Joseph Blazuk]

Unless I'm missing something, you still haven't described what your problem is/pain you're having.

[Coach Sommer]

Hey there,

Ive been having elbow problems since late January 2014.

The trigger of my problem was probably(!) a combination of those two exercises:

-Swedish Bars Front Support ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvuWwMcwRXM )

-Swedish Bars Back Support ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDCr_lXDd64&list=UUPCiBMarvDiTx-lknzt934g )

I combined them into following interval sequence:

D1. Swedish Bars Front Support 10-30 sec

D2. Swedish Bars Back Support 10-30 sec

-Repeat D1, D2 for a total of 5 sets, resting 45-90 sec between exercises

*I found this whole sequence on Ido Portal's blog and youtube account. However, i had basically no experience before in straight arm strength or support exercises ( maybe done L-sits some times before, however nothing structured). Means, my elbows weren't prepared at all for this stress, and of course, it resulted in injury. Around the same time, i messed around with tucked front lever and back lever tucks,-probably progressed too quick here too- that may have contributed to the paint injury symptoms I've been having since then. However, i did a heck lot of unstructured strength training, skill work , played more tennis than usual at that time, so it could also be some "collective injury/pain trigger". Basically: I was totally retarded.

​When Im looking back, Im thinking like " wtf did you do to your body?- injury out of what you did was a certainty".

This was in late January 2014.

​So , please don't tell me this was dumb.

Much rather, Id appreciate any input what you would do in my situation.

What I did so far:

Since then, Ive been to 2 doctors, and 3 physios.- Yet, nothing great has changed. 1 doctor and 1 physio was shit, ( diagnosis of them: tendonitis or bursitis, advice: rest and it will go away. also: never extend your elbows fully!! - "yes for sure, i thought",- and went.

The other sports orthopedist and physio ( and osteopath ) both diagnosed me ( independently of each other) with some kind of ulnar irritation.- this made perfect sense, as my pain was in that funny bone- area, and when i accidentally would bump my elbow against something- it would hurt as well. So: DIAGNOSIS: Some kind of Ulnar Nerve Irritation. However, its very local and ISN’T radiating down the arm, and also ISN’T initiating some tingling sensations in my pinky.

The sports orthopedist also found out ( via x-ray and visual inspection) that my elbows are having some slight valgus deformity- means their angles isn't around 180 degrees, but more about 168 degrees. Hence- he said- i ve been predisposed to those problems,and this external stress triggered my injury. He prescribed me physiotherapy for strengthening and stabilizing the elbow joint as well as ultrasonic therapy and cryotherapy. Im doing ultrasonic 2 x a week, each arm 10 min. , right after it cryotherapy 1 min. i think, also both elbows.

Then, last week, my phyio added a new thing to this Diagnosis: He said he thinks my ulnar nerve isn’t really lying inside the cubital tunnel properly, it is more like slid up ( the medial epycondile i guess). Hence, increased friction ( because of that improper alignment) to my ulnar nerve could be the reason why my elbow still is doing trouble to me. ( Considering i stopped doing all sports since i found out this could be something severe ( around the beginning of March 2014, maybe even earlier).

Supplements: Im also taking the following supplements (as advised my 2 good(!) physios:)

• Vitamin B complex
• Vitamin D
• liquid fish oil, 2 teaspoons a day

Exercises:

Those exercises have been prescribed to me recently:

• side-lying external rotation with 1kg dumbbell ( 3 x ~20, daily)

• Sitting/Standing External Rotation with 2 kg in each hand (3x ~20, daily). ( heres a photo of this so we both talk about the same: http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/cms/articleimages/884/External-Rotation-Standing2.jpg

So im doing those exercises daily, and also go to the physio about 2 times a week, where he does some manual manipulation. He said my ulnar nerve isn’t really in its "cubital tunnel" and IF its in,it always tends to hop out again , so he tries to bring it back in its groove permanently via some nerve mobility manipulation. The given exercises should reinforce so much stability to it, so it will hold the nerve stable. Also he tries to get some tension out of the adjacent muscles, also out of the neck, the lats and the upper arm. ( Since the nerve is going all the way down from the neck to the pinky). Thats about what was told to me.

So this is about my treatment plan, but im not very sure if it will really give me the kind of relief i was hoping for. Until now, it didn't.

If you'd had any input, Id be very glad.

Thank you!

 

Exposing beginners to these intermediate exercises is beyond irresponsible.  

 

Getting injured from prematurely attempting to train these exercises was inevitable.

 

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

[Rajesh Bhat]

Foundation and Handstand is designed to fix your problems. Plus they're just plain cool