Giants

[Bacila]

Hi, everybody. Can anyone pass some tips for back giants, ie conditioning exercises on the floor which either strenghten needed muscles or help to familirize with pattern of the movement, like dragon flag and backward roll. On the bar I'm working on hip circles and hang to inverted. Any help will be apriciated. PS sorry for my pidgin - English isn't my mothertongue.

[Guest mpetnuch]

Since, as you said, English is not your first language, I am not sure if you are asking for help for the right skill. But if you really are asking about back giants I will do my best to help.

I really don't think there is specific conditioning exercise to giants. The only thing that I would say would be helpful would be to work cast to handstands on a low bar. Once you have a decent cast, a back giant is very simple. I would say about 30 degree above horizontal cast is all the is required to complete a decent giant. Obviously the higher you cast the easier the giant will be (assuming you understand the tap).

The second thing I would work on is good tap swings. From a high start (i.e. bring your legs to the bar and then aggressivly swing them back and arch) to get yourself started, you want to swing on the bar making sure that you are hollow (see you toes) in the back swing and then right before you pass under the bottom of the bar begin to arch slightly. Then after you pass through the bottom you want to kick with your toes (the tap) toward the ceiling bringing yourself back to the hollow position. As your swings get larger the kick can become later allowing you to get high and higher.

Once you have those down pat, you cast to handstand on a high bar, making sure to hollow out, arch at the bottom, and kick to hollow in the second phase and bamn you have a giant :-)

Good luck.

P.S. Always make sure you do all of these under supervision of a coach or a spotter. It is very hard to get the body positions correct by yourself without the aid of someone else. You almost always will think your body is in a better position than what it really is. Also, for saftey as well.

[Bacila]

Thank you for respond. To do giant from just swinging with a tap higher and higher was my very first idea. Basic problem is that after I've reach some height in end of each swing I have to "jump" (with shoulders) or regrasp in order to keep the grip. This eats momentum and I end up swinging in the same range till exhaustion. If i try to tap harder I just pike. I did some research on the net and believe that realistical skill progression is hip circles>baby giant(pullover)>back giant. While trying to do baby giant hardest is cast to handst (can't open shoulders). I can do cast to hst on floor but on bar I'm just freak out ending up in hanstand/planche hybrid. I don't have access to low or floor bar, but recently found out that doing cast to hst on knuckles(fist) pretty close mimicks feeling of thatone on bar

[Blairbob]

Bacila, do you have access to a strap in pvc system on a men's rail at the gym you go to? This will allow you to learn how to swing big as well as learn where and when to " tap."

Simply, you are going to have to regrip or hop your grip in the back swing.

Keep your head throughout the entire swing. Head neutral.

I've never seen anybody giant from just a general tap swing, but I have seen footage of it on pbars and rings, so I'm sure it's possible. This would just take a bit of time to learn ( even if you are physically ready ).

You also need to learn how to bail from the cast into the long hang. Scary at first, but you gotta practice this. Gotta learn how to cast into handstand as well. If your bail gets good, you won't need to cast as high.

Here are some good articles about giant swings.

In my opinion back extension rolls and clear/free hip circle have some similarity to back giants but not exactly the same thing. Swinging pullover/baby giant seems to be a cop out skill in it's early phases. I teach giants with a spot first and in straps, besides huge swings. If they get somewhere in this and still are not ready to do giants by competitive season, I'll teach the swinging pullover till it becomes the baby giant.

http://www.usa-gymnastics.org/publicati ... swing.html

http://www.usa-gymnastics.org/publicati ... orner.html

http://www.gymnasticsrevolution.com/Parents%2021.html

http://www.gym.net/useca/drills%20and%2 ... drills.pdf

[Bacila]

You guys are amazing and giving tons of info, but I think I need to clarify some things. When I've mentioned that I have no access to low/floor bar, I've ment that I haven't saw them in my life! Well, high bar too... You see there isn't such thing as recreational/adult gymnastics where I live, also its equipment. So alternatives to h bar (turnik... anyone?) aren't easily accessible, varries in height, grip width and aren't springy at all. That's why i'm trying to know about every possibly helpful conditioning exercise on the floor. Am I just loony and it ain't happen or is it still hope for me to do giant? PS articles from links are cool but all of them I knew before, except last one. I can't read .pdf because i'm browsing via mobile.

[Coach Sommer]

Excellent information provided, well done gentlemen.

I would recommend using gloves (simple cloth gardening variety) and straps rather than a section of pvc and straps. Training giants utilizing the pvc does not require the athlete to learn correct wrist work, while the gloves will naturally teach the re-gripping and wrist shifting necessary for giant work. Someone who has learned giants with gloves and straps will easily make the transition to no straps; however someone who has learned giants with pvc and straps will struggle, often for extended periods of time, trying to make the same transition.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

[Blairbob]

Wait a tic...are you training giants on something under than a gymnastics high bar? I've seen it done by stuntmen before, but most were gymnasts/acrobats beforehand.

Instead of the pdf, here ya go:

http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:vnDDP8gcGbEJ:www.gym.net/useca/drills...

[Edited by George: I truncated the above link as it made the page too wide to read easily for the majority of users. Hope this is OK. It will work fine when you click it.]

Here are some more cool bars pages from USA gymnastics. However, they do not come out well via html since they have graphics.

http://www.usa-gymnastics.org/publications/technique/2001/1/page1.pdf

http://www.usa-gymnastics.org/publications/technique/2001/1/page2.pdf

http://www.usa-gymnastics.org/publications/technique/2001/1/page3.pdf

http://www.usa-gymnastics.org/publications/technique/2001/1/page4.pdf

[Blairbob]

So, Coach Sommer, are you saying they should train strap giants in gloves then? Never heard of this before, but it's intriguing. I might be up to coaching this after some R&D first and having a kid learn a strap giant. I'm kind of worried about them slipping in the strap with gloves.

[Guest Valentin]

We have always used straps and gloves (basic gardening gloves do the job really well...these would be at least the kind sold in NZ). I have tried both PVC bar and Gloves, and i have to strongly agree with Coach that gloves is better, from a learning point and in order to transfer the skill to the actual bar. Its a little harder then with a PVC bar, but its just as effective.

Our kids put gloves, wrist bands, and then the straps, but i have done it just with gloves and straps. As long as you correctly put on the straps and they are tight enough its very safe, or at least equally as safe as the PVC bar.