Developing the Iron Cross

[Guest Valentin]

Hi

I was wondering how people here have developed their Iron Crosses. what has worked for you what has not, what you recommend what you, what you don't etc..

For young gymnasts and for adults.

Coach Sommer at what age if any in particular, or what pre-requisites do you require from an athlete before you start them on crosses?

Thanks everyone

Valentin

[gymrob]

I haven't ever attempted one, but I would advise (from what I've read) against young kids doing it since it is very strenuous on the elbows.

Proper form is also vital. Here is a guide from someone who has developed it:

http://performancemenu.com/shorties/index.php?show=shorty&shortyID=32

Thank you

[Alex]

I think that I've seen Jordan Jovtchev doing leg supported Iron Crosses. So legs straight out in front, in an L'situp position (supported) just lowering in and out of the crosses for reps.

Does that make sense?

Edit: 3rd picture along in the link Rob posted.

[kbryk]

Yes, Alex those are assisted cross pullouts, I used to do those they are good, but try out some theraband assisted crosses.

[John Sapinoso]

For that above exercise, make sure you pull your arms straight to the side, I've noticed that those beginning these tend to have their arms behind them.

If it's too hard you can have your legs higher up on the block as it will increase your leverage.

I also advocate performing these with your feet on a swiss ball as you progress in order to add instability, work the core and other stabilizers. It's also easier to gauge your progression by noting the depression on the ball, the rounder it is the less leg spot you're using, the flatter it is, the more.

For me a cross feels like a mix between a pull-up and a dip, the Bulgarian dips that Coach Sommer posted are helpful, just make sure you're emulating the cross position with your upperarms.

I also did weighted static holds in a pull up with upper arms in a cross, making a 90 degree angle with forearms. For those, you can engage your lats more by focusing on pulling your elbows down and relaxing your biceps...rather than thinking of pulling your body up.

(adequate bicep strength is required though since there is heavy strain on the elbows, see Coach's article on Cirques)

Another thing I did was lots of wide straight arm kips through the cross pull to support.

And of course there's always spotted crosses and pulls, and bungee assisted crosses and pulls, and if you shorten the length of the strap it makes it easier as well.

I advocate spotted crosses, since both the spotter and the crosser will get stronger.

One more thing I did just for general rings strength is support swings with rings turned out of course, but those you have to do on a tower, or the strap will swing too much.

If you're really just beginning, you can do upper arm fly's on p-bars.

I'd recommend using an overgrip in the beginning.

[Guest Valentin]

Thanks guys, these are all good tips and ideas

I have tried most exercises here (aside from the assisted L-crosses)..

What do you guys recommend reps,sets, ROM wise.

For example its clear that reps should be in between 3-5, sets of about 3-5 as well.

Full ROM, or build it up?

Statics or Concentric or Eccentric...what kind of muscle actions is best.. is it better to mix, or keep it strictly to one kind of contraction per session?

Reach failure or keep it just short of.. Given that to work it, it would be a maximal effort, i guess its not till failure.

Thanks again

[gymrob]

I'm not 100% on this but I would advise not going to failure on a regular basis since it is very CNS intensive and can hinder your ability to do the exercise straight after to your full ability.

I would stay a few seconds away from failure with isometric holds, or 1-2 reps with exercises.

Hope this helps.

[Blairbob]

GymRob. I've heard a general rule not to train young gymnasts till after the onset of puberty as well when most of their bones are fused.

While the danger of their elbows is possible, I have heard tell that the danger to their breastbone is far more dangerous. I've heard of kids injuring this by falling through the pbars in upper arm support or just in general. As well, ring support often causes strain on that part of the chest ( and I've heard of it causing pain period in any support work with weak athletes ).

I actually heard a few years ago of a 10 or 11 yo doing a cross for an exhibition. Because of the code, I don't think it is allowed till an athlete is 12. In fact I had heard this boy was from AZ ( could it have been one of yours, Coach S? )

[John Sapinoso]

Personally, I do most rings work in 5 x 5.

[Geoffrey Taucer]

There are four excercises that I and my guys use to work crosses; two for those who are just starting, and two for the stronger kids who have been working them for awhile.

When my guys are just starting crosses, I have them do modified crosses on low rings; rather than holding the rings in their hands, they put their arms through the rings, so that the rings are between the elbow and the armpit. They then hold a cross like this. As they get stronger, they can move the rings further out from the armpits to increase resistance. I typically have them do 3 or 4 sets of 15 seconds.

The second excersize I use for beginners is simply a jump to support with straight arms. I have them stack enough mats under the low rings so that when they are standing straight, the rings are at about head height. They then stand with their arms straight out, like a cross, and jump up to support without bending their arms. They typically do sets of 10-20 of these. Admittedly this does not isolate the shoulders; they're using their legs as well. But generally the jump alone is only enough to get them to -- at the highest -- about 45 degrees above the cross. They have to supplement this momentum with shoulder strength.

Once they can do modified crosses with the rings out past their elbows, approaching their wrists, I have them switch to the more advanced exercizes.

The first is a stretch-band-assisted cross hold. They put a stretch band through the rings, with a decent amount of slack in the middle, and then put their hands on top of the band to grip the rings and hold the band in place. They get to a support, put their feet in the band (so they're stretching it downward), and then lower to cross and hold for 5-10 seconds before pulling out. The stretch band holds some of their weight. THe difficulty here can be adjusted by varying the amount of slack in the band at the start, and by using heavier/lighter bands.

The fourth exercize is the same as the third, but without a hold. Using the stretch band, they lower from support to just below a cross, then immediately pull back out. I typically do 5 or so of these in a set, with the lightest band I can find.