Can one do GST and lift weights?

[Jojo Colinares]

Hi!

 

I'm just wondering how gymnasts eventually get those ripped bodies.

Have they ever lifted weights or was it just because of the discipline in going through the series?

Can a chubby person really get ripped through GST (without ever doing weightlifting)?

In Coach's one video in Stretch series, he mentioned that "Stretch series shouldn't be done before a workout. As to what type of workout, it's up to you." Or something like that.

Does that mean that one can also insert lifting weights on top of Foundation and Stretches?

Thanks! 

Jojo

[Benjamin Nutt]

The general answer is yes, you can lift weights while following the GB programs. As to programming, there are a few things to keep in mind.

 

1. GST will make you a better lifter. The strength and mobility gains you make through GST will transfer over to the weight room.

2. It's generally advised to complete your foundation work PRIOR to lifting, assuming you'll be lifting weights in the same workout. This is because GST will expose and shore up strength/mobility imbalances produced by training for one of those in isolation. Think of it as prehab and rehab.

3. Coach advises to think of your weight training as maintenance work and prioritize shoring up your weaknesses with GST. So, if your max back squat is 225, maybe back off to sets of a more comfortable weight like 185 to maintain strength and motor patterns.

4. DEFINITELY do the Stretch series AFTER lifting. Otherwise, you'll be too relaxed/fatigued and will probably get crushed beneath the barbell. 

5. If you're too fatigued to lift weights after your Foundation sessions, it might be time to put the barbell down for a while and focus on Foundation at least up through F2.

6. As far as programming goes, a program like 5/3/1 pairs with GST nicely. 5/3/1 profresss slowly, much like GST. Your schedule could look like Press + Handstand, Squat+Core, Upper+Bench, Deadlift+Lower, Movement on weekends, Stretch series in the evenings. 

Hope this is helpful. Disclaimer: I am not an expert, so maybe one of the forum coaches can answer better than I can. This is just what I've picked up from experience and from consuming Coach's interviews on Podcasts.

Also, FWIW, I love lifting weights, but have found that training GST exclusively has been much more rewarding in terms of general movement and fitness. I do still deadlift, though, because I feel it's such a hugely beneficial motor pattern that really can't be replicated through BW means (unlike pressing, squatting, and pulling).

[Jojo Colinares]

Hi Benjamin!

This us indeed very helpful.

I'm lifting inconsistently thus I don't understand 5/3/1 much.

The schedule that you suggested could be at least 2 hrs since Handstand alone could be 40min (based on Stretch series). Do you mean this is to be done in one sitting? And Stretch series can be done every night?

Btw, I have enrolled in Foundation 1 and Stretch series only. I even find the Core intimidating esp at 48 counts (Bent Hollow Body Rock).

Thanks for your time again.

 

Jojo

 

[Benjamin Nutt]

I combined lifting with Foundation for a while and it only took about an hour between Foundation series and a single core lift.

The schedule I laid out is only one of MANY possibilities. If you're a novice lifter, you might benefit from a simpler rep scheme like 3*5, still at a reasonable "mainetenance" weight. so maybe:

Core + Back Squat 3*5

Upper + Bench or Press 3*5

Lower + Deadlift 1*5

Regarding Stretch series, no, I don't mean every night. I mean doing each series once a week, at night. That's how I do it, anyway. You could do it during your other workouts, or on "off" days. The point is just to make sure you don't do it PRIOR to resistance training. Potential schedules:

AM: Strength

PM: Stretch

Or

Monday/Wednesday/Friday: Strength

Tuesday/Thursday/Saturday: Stretch

Once again, you gotta do what works for you based on your ability to recover and make consistent improvement.

[Luke Searra]

As a general rule to combining GST with weightlifting, I will not give you a template but I will say this: You should definitely do GST after weightlifting.

[Jojo Colinares]

Thanks a lot Benjamin.

Really appreciate it. Will mix and match according to this as well as doing some Resistance training (I used to do Strength training with Tower 200 resistance band).

Thanks again.

[Jojo Colinares]

2 minutes ago, Luke Searra said:

As a general rule to combining GST with weightlifting, I will not give you a template but I will say this: You should definitely do GST after weightlifting.

I'll keep that in mind Luke.

Thanks!

[Joshua Daudelin]

On 8/1/2017 at 0:47 PM, Luke Searra said:

As a general rule to combining GST with weightlifting, I will not give you a template but I will say this: You should definitely do GST after weightlifting.

Curious as to why you would say this Luke, would you care to explain your thought behind this?

I personally incorporate weight training and cardio training throughout the week in conjunction with GST though my bias has been toward GST as training and the lifting/running/whatever else more for 'sport'. If days line up where I know I'll be Oly lifting or dead lifting as well as doing the GST core series I would probably tend to do the core work after as accessory work due to the fact that lifting with an over-fatigued core could spell disaster. If I'm squatting I may be inclined to use GST lower body first as a 'warm up' type thing. My general train of thought is to be smart with the placement of the exercises to maximize available energy.

[Benjamin Nutt]

On 8/4/2017 at 9:15 AM, Joshua Daudelin said:

Curious as to why you would say this Luke, would you care to explain your thought behind this?

I personally incorporate weight training and cardio training throughout the week in conjunction with GST though my bias has been toward GST as training and the lifting/running/whatever else more for 'sport'. If days line up where I know I'll be Oly lifting or dead lifting as well as doing the GST core series I would probably tend to do the core work after as accessory work due to the fact that lifting with an over-fatigued core could spell disaster. If I'm squatting I may be inclined to use GST lower body first as a 'warm up' type thing. My general train of thought is to be smart with the placement of the exercises to maximize available energy.

Not Luke, obviously, but I'd imagine it has something to do with fatigue.

Being fatigued while manipulating your own body weight is gerneally less dangerous than being fatigued while manipulating an external load. If you're fatigued while doing push-ups, you can just drop and be fine. If you're fatigued while squatting 300 pounds, you're likely to hurt yourself.

[Jennifer Marie]

Agreed Ben. My lifting coach told me to stop doing core work before lifting sessions because I shouldn't have shredded abs when trying to move the barbell. I had more time before class than after, but tried it anyway. Timing does make a difference in my Olympic lifts, but timing didn't make much difference to a good core workout. 

 

[Ronnicky Roy]

On 8/4/2017 at 11:15 AM, Joshua Daudelin said:

Curious as to why you would say this Luke, would you care to explain your thought behind this?

I personally incorporate weight training and cardio training throughout the week in conjunction with GST though my bias has been toward GST as training and the lifting/running/whatever else more for 'sport'. If days line up where I know I'll be Oly lifting or dead lifting as well as doing the GST core series I would probably tend to do the core work after as accessory work due to the fact that lifting with an over-fatigued core could spell disaster. If I'm squatting I may be inclined to use GST lower body first as a 'warm up' type thing. My general train of thought is to be smart with the placement of the exercises to maximize available energy.

My guess would be assuming your lifting is strength training specific, like reverse pyramid training. You want all of your strength in the tank when you go into that. GST beforehand will take away from that progression. While GST work you can do later in the day, even if you did strength work hours before hand. Like I can do Incline bench and still finish my reps on pushups later, because it's technically speaking less weight. But if I tax my endurance doing pushups I likely won't be pressing the same weight on incline. Unless you're doing warm up reps with pushups, then going into bench you're likely not going to have positive results in the workout. 

Unless you're already doing upper level F3 work, you'll probably want to do weights first and use GST for conditioning/mobility work. That mobility will even you out and improve your lifting as has been said. I'd say the only caveat would be if you're mixing H1/H2 work with overhead weighted movements. That'll change around a bit depending on where you're at in both. If you can do solid headstand presses by the wall, then you'll probably be fine doing military/overhead presses later (assuming you press less than bodyweight overhead). Because the balance isn't a factor there, so you have all your stabilizers assisting you, when they're not really being taxed. It's like going from pushups on a basketball, to standard pushups. Your stabilizers are firing on all cylinders, while doing a technically easier task. I can't speak for Luke obviously, but that's my guess as to the reasoning

[Coach Sommer]

I disagree with Luke,

If you are not advanced enough to consider your F1 work as a warmup, you are not yet strong enough to be lifting weights intensely.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

[Jojo Colinares]

Thanks a lot coach.

To be honest, I am not doing good in my F1. In fact, I almost totally abandoned GST simply because I couldn't accomplish 5x36 Bent Hollow Rock let alone 5x48.

Instead, I'm doing 40-min dumbbell routines and 5-8km runs 5-6x a week in alternate.

So far so good as far as my weight loss goal is concern but I know I'm not hitting my foundations.

And I know it's stupid to just throw away GST just because of that Core challenge.

Maybe it was also because of the platform that I couldn't even take a peek of what's next that made me leave GST for a while now. But if I'd just click "Easy" just to skip that exercise, I felt I'd be fooling nobody else but me.

Anyway, I hope I'll find my way back soon.

Thanks!

 

Jojo

[Tanya Hill]

Hi Jojo! 

I feel like we have all been there. Definitely take a peek in your Foundation Library and you can see all the exercises included in the course. 

Training always goes up and down, jump back in! Things that come easy are not worth having.  

[Jojo Colinares]

Thanks a lot for the heads up Tanya. I thought I'd just wait till I complete a set before I can see the rest of it.

Anyway, I did cut my dumbbells by half and instead went for 30 min for my complete GST routine. I simply went through all of it (including 5x36 BHR. 

I'll slowly go back.

Thanks again.

[Steven Cayre]

On 2/11/2018 at 3:35 PM, Coach Sommer said:

I disagree with Luke,

If you are not advanced enough to consider your F1 work as a warmup, you are not yet strong enough to be lifting weights intensely.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

Hi Coach Sommer, thanks for your comment. To clarify are you suggesting that the entire GST routine be completed prior to beginning one’s weight training routine OR should the parallel GST movement, as an example GST Pushups, be completed prior to performing an exercise like DB Bench Press? Thanks for any further clarity you can share with the community. Steven

[Luke Searra]

@Coach Sommer

[Mark Chin]

Just my 2 cents... 

I used to do a powerlifting routine (Starting Strength - > Texas Method - > Sheiko) which got me to 400 DL, 260 BP, 360 SQ, 178 press. Not impressive numbers, but not terrible for someone who didn't start until 40 years old. 

Now, I just do Gymnasticbodies. Once I got some way into the progressions, the idea of doing the barbell lifts just seemed ridiculous. I mean, I am *gassed* from these workouts. Sore all the time. Having to carefully program to avoid overuse injuries. Eating carefully and managing sleep to recover properly. Moving my rest days around. If you spend some time and thought, this system will kick your ass. For years. 

I have been thinking i will do some barbell lifts when I finish F4... Meaning no time soon. 

M

[Everett Carroll]

On 5/18/2018 at 7:57 PM, Steven Cayre said:

Hi Coach Sommer, thanks for your comment. To clarify are you suggesting that the entire GST routine be completed prior to beginning one’s weight training routine OR should the parallel GST movement, as an example GST Pushups, be completed prior to performing an exercise like DB Bench Press?

My interpretation of what Coach is saying is if any of the movements in F1 aren't easy enough for you to consider warm-up material, then you have no business intensely weight training. Essentially, if F1 is challenging for you, then your basic mobility and strength are HIGHLY compromised and you have other business to attend to before you almost certainly worsen your physical situation (or at least mobility) with lifting. I don't think he's saying F1 must be your lifting warm up, but simply that it should be a possibility. Competence with F1 says a lot about someones physical readiness for other activities.

[Joachim Hecht]

It's a bit like coach said about leg training: No additional weight until single leg squat is mastered! 

Something about F1 @Jojo Colinares: I did like you... Easy smiley and going through the next step and boom... plateau! As soon as I really got into the mastery system everything changed. I restarted everything up from PE 1 and spent like 8 weeks on refining the first PE of Handstand 1 for example. Still trying to perfect things like Scap Shrugs and so far away from a perfect MN/PE1... If you really start posting videos and getting review from the coaches you will see how much correction is needed... But on the other hand everything gets stronger and feels better from week to week. Nonetheless i'm a petty fool and lift weights from time to time  like bench press after core or presses after handstand and stuff. Hope this helps!

[Alison McGuire]

I've done Olympic Weightlifting (which includes powerlifting) for about 2 years 3x weekly. Midlife, female joiner.  Just started GB on my off days & I'm hopeful it will correct weakness, plateaus, imbalances, & generally toughen up ye olde connective tissue which is so critically important yet 'invisible'.

Can't see why you couldn't combine weights (whatever the flavor) and GB.  Stands to reason they would help each other.

[Jojo Colinares]

@Mark Chin I've temporarily stopped by weights since June (after joining my first ever Spartan race). I could have probably done better in the race had I religiously done GST. 

I agree with you that even with GST, one will run out of time working out especially if he or she's working 9-5 (in our case it's 8-5). A Core workout alone will take 25 min, let alone putting in Upper and Lower. I have only 1 hour window before the kids get up at 6.

I'm trying my best now to not break the chain - at least 5x a week of workout. If I'd put all weeks side by side and put an X mark for weeks with at least 5X of workout, then I'll have a chain. The longer the chain with no breaks, the better.

But GST plays a vital role as I think I wouldn't need anything else (aside from running). 

I think this is also what @Coach Sommer meant when he said "If you are not advanced enough to consider your F1 work as a warmup, you are not yet strong enough to be lifting weights intensely."

Thus, the DB are out for now.

Thanks!